Election 2012-Are Christians Crying-“Give Us Barabus”?


It’s election year, and there is no shortage of opinions. And everyone seems to be eager to express theirs.. Webster Tarpley is no exception. Days away from the election we are  privileged to get a bird’s-eye view of what to expect in the months and years after the election, (in Tarpley’s opinion, as a historian and very astute political observer). Even though Tarpley appears not to be a Christian, he certainly has a rather uncanny and prophetic take on political and world events past, present and what appears to be the outcome of the not so distant future events. History does repeat itself, right? Tarpley is an intellectual giant, and frankly, I’m astonished at the plethora of good solid information this man has in his arsenal of information. I’d trust his opinion any day compared to the lying controlled media, to know what’s really going on behind the scenes.

That said,   Webster Tarpley may be a genius at knowing and understanding what’s happening in the secular realm, but as Christians we are to know and understand what God wants us to know and do in the spiritual realm and then apply these things to our lives. In a nutshell, I have to agree with Berean call here, that maintaining our comfort zone and status quo in this world, (and nation),  needs to be last tbing on our list of spiritual priorities.


“We have no reason to doubt that we live in challenging times. Nor can we deny that our Sovereign Creator and Lord will weigh all nations and individuals in His holy balance. According to Philippians 3:20, “…our conversation [citizenship] is in heaven; from whence also we look for the Saviour, the Lord Jesus Christ.” Even though our citizenship is in heaven, we recognize the commission given by God to the church to preach the gospel (Mt 28:19-20, Mk 16:15, Lk 24:47, Jn:20:21Then said Jesus to them again, Peace be unto you: as my Father hath sent me, even so send I you., Acts:1:8But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth.). There is no other hope to be found in this world.

It should be of great concern to us to see how too many have uncritically joined with false teachers simply because they are saying “good things.” Christians are joining with cultists in order to preserve their temporal life in this temporal world. There are biblical issues for which Christians must stand, regardless of the cost. We have the assurance of Scripture that “The angel of the Lord encampeth round about them that fear him, and delivereth them” (Ps:34:7The angel of the LORD encampeth round about them that fear him, and delivereth them.).

Knowing this promise, why are so many willing to camp with the enemies of the gospel? After the publication of our article addressing The Harbinger , critics asked us, “Aren’t you concerned for the preservation of this nation ?” Is that to be our motivation?

If “success,” rather than the Lord himself, becomes our object, we put ourselves in a position in which we could embrace anyone or anything that seems to provide a solution. The Lord inspired Paul to write, “Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God” (Col:3:2-3 [2] Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.
[3] For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.



  Next, please scroll down below the snip to what Pastor Chuck Baldwin has to say about, what, in his opinion, American Christians need to do about kicking the devil out of the government and apparently taking America back for God……….. and in our own self defense.

Finally, please go into the comment section, if you wish, to follow onto a discussion between myself and another Christian concerning the pros and cons about taking up arms in defense of Christendom and the Constitution, since the rather in-depth discussion on another thread got rather off topic and I decided to transfer the comments to this post.



“You have heard the buzz words of this austerity campaign. We are told that we are approaching a horrendous fiscal cliff which must be addressed during the lame-duck session of Congress. In reality, there is no fiscal cliff — it is a myth invented by reactionaries and proto-fascists. The lame-duck session suits Wall Street because many congressmen will be defeated or retiring, and looking to Wall Street for future jobs and lucrative consultancies. We are told we need a Grand Bargain. In reality, the Grand Bargain will be orders of magnitude worse than the Satan sandwich embraced by Obama and the Republicans in August 2011, on the brink of a totally unnecessary US national bankruptcy.

While many victims of the current system fix their attention on the presidential contest, the preparations for murderous austerity are in full swing behind the scenes in Washington. Leading the charge is the so-called Gang of Eight in the United States Senate, more accurately known as the Crapo Commission in honor of Republican Senator Mike Crapo of Idaho, the reactionary Mormon who is one of its leading figures. Other gangsters of the Gang of Eight include Saxby Chambliss of Georgia, Lamar Alexander of the prison industrial complex, and Dick Durbin of the corrupt Illinois bipartisan combine. These political gangsters are now colluding with Obama to shred the economic rights acquired by the American people over centuries of political, labor, and civil rights struggles.

Backing up the Gang of Eight is the so-called Simpson-Bowles commission, known more accurately as the Catfood Commission, since this is what senior citizens will be reduced to living on if their demands go through. Former Senator Alan Simpson of Wyoming is a decrepit misanthrope who has left little doubt that he thinks senior citizens should be exterminated to relieve the pressures on the federal budget and open the door to bigger and better bailouts of the Wall Street zombie banks in the near future. Erskine Bowles is a former Morgan Stanley zombie banker himself who joined with Newt Gingrich to wreck Social Security during the second Clinton administration when he was White House Chief of Staff, and would have succeeded — until Miss Lewinsky came along.
Wall Street Austerity Ghouls Run Wild

Halloween will soon be upon us, and the austerity ghouls are running wild in the Witches’ Sabbath of class warfare against working people. The Satanic orchestrator of much of this has over recent decades been Peter Peterson, the former head of Lehman Brothers, the bank whose orgy of derivatives speculation blew apart the world banking system four years ago. But, against all evidence, Peterson and the Wall Street faction he speaks for continue to argue that the current depression has been caused by excessive spending on entitlements and the social safety net, and not by hot money speculation, derivatives, and hedge funds — which is what actually happened four years ago.

These are the forces with whom Obama has said he is “eager” to reach a grand bargain on the backs of the American people.”

Now then comes Pastor Chuck Baldwin, as the champion of Christians wishing to “take back America for God and the Constitution” and his world view, of which I for one have been skeptical.  Let’s just say, I may agree with his opinion of the current back-slidden state of the church and corrupt political situation, but I am very leary of his solution!

“How did Christians become War mongers?”


Chuck says:

Yes, I’ve been an evangelical Christian for most of my life and an evangelical pastor for most of my adult life. And if we Christians do not quickly repent of this bloodlust that seems to dominate evangelical Christianity today (spiritually and militarily), the word that was first used by un-churched Gentiles to describe Christ’s followers will be used as a curse-word to describe those who facilitated the ruination of our country, because “whatsoever a [nation] soweth, that shall [it] also reap.”

4 comments on “Election 2012-Are Christians Crying-“Give Us Barabus”?

  1. Scarlett says:

    This is a PS Gordon…this has been kind of a crazy week, but anyways I just wanted to say we may disagree “somewhat” on solutions to Americas obvious governmental problems, however, I consider you one of the best guys around in the LORD. For sure, I am appalled at the recent stance of the Billy Graham ministries sell out to Romney Mormonism, and so many Christians buying into it.

    I’m afraid this is going to get very ugly before it’s over. Well, of course it is…we read the book of Revelation. These things will come to pass.

    Just watched this video on Alex Jones tonight because I like Gerald Celente.

    Psychopaths run the Planet:



  2. Gordon D.G. says:

    Hi, Scarlett. I think, it seems, when it comes right down to it, that the Church really should be, at this point because of what’s up ahead…..the Church should be evangelising and discipling, rather than fighting for an Baseball-Apple pie country that will never be again. It’s funny, because, it used to be that too many in the Church did not want to “get involved with Politics, because, her job is to be concerned for the spiritual condition of the souls of men” when, in reality, the SHOULD’ve gotten poilitically involved to be a “Salt” and a “Light” to the country they lived in and keep the Torch of TRUE Religious Freedom burning. But, now, because of the Godless, corroded and immorally decayed condition of America, GOD is bringing America down in Judgment, and the thing to be most concerned about is “soul-Salvation” for all. I do believe this. But, I feel that we should also stand up for what is “RIGHT” for as long as we are alive and are American citizens. Like the musicians who continued to play music as the TITANIC was sinking. Let me know what you think about this. GOD Bless you! Gordon

    • Scarlett says:

      Gordon, I will always agree that being salt and light is- evangelizing- in and of itself. We are told to take up OUR Cross, deny OUR SELF, and follow Jesus. That’s job one…following HIM, not a worldly form.

      As for standing up for “what is right” in the context of God and Country, I guess it depends on what people think is “right” and secondly how to go about “standing up for it”. Now, I have heard Chuck Baldwin, (and he’s not the only one by any means) talk his talk for years, but thing is, he never gets past go on any real solutions. Just more talk. He never actually does anything except get folks stirred up. I guess it looks like he wants to start the second American Revolution or a civil war, forgetting how bloody, costly and awful those were.
      That said…..
      Is HE going to lead the charge into battle, guns blazing, to do what he thinks is “right”? I guess I would have to say to him, “You go first Mr. Baldwin”.


  3. Scarlett says:

    This is the followup copy and pasted comments from another post on this blog that I am placing here where they are more appropriate:


    Yes, I know a lot of people follow Chuck Baldwin, but I don’t and I wouldn’t advise other Christians to either. He is too militant! Christ never called Christians to rise up against the government or try to legislate morality by changing laws. Also, Madame Guyon and her “mysticism” is very dangerous and bordering on channeling demons in my opinion. Unfortunately, a lot of Christians mistakenly seeking “a deeper experience” get involved in this fleshly endeavor, which, bottom line is no different than transcendental meditation or eastern mysticism.

    Thanks for your comments, your efforts are greatly appreciated and edifying.



    edit this on October 25, 2012 at 1:58 pm | Reply Gordon D.G.

    Scarlett, Usually I agree with what you’ve said, but, here, I have to take issue. I am familiar with Chuck Baldwin. I voted for him in 2008. The man is a “man after GOD’s own Heart”. And, he knows the Holy Bible and the U.S. Constitution, and how it’s supposed to be interpreted. How can defending the true interpretation of the U.S. Constitution ever be “too militant”? ROMANS 13 applies when the leaders and authorities have respect unto GOD’s Basic Laws. Our current Prez and politicos do none of that. They totally TWIST the meaning of the U.S. Constitution in order to help morph America into a “3rd-world/Communist/Socialist/all-of-the-above/total-loss-of-freedom country”, that will be subject to the future kingdom of the Anti-Christ, the NWO. The Scriptures say that the “Kingdom of Heaven suffers Violence, and the Violent take it by FORCE.” Entering GOD’s Kingdom costs each one of us a Fight. No pew-warmers will ever enter GOD’s beautiful Heavenly Paradise. There are no current Presidential Candidates worth voting for, and I believe that it is a “sign” that GOD is primed to lay down the Judgment onto Sodomite/Babylonian America. i.e., that, GOD has not raised up a Presidential Candidate who would be suitable for the job, for HE is saying that it’s OVER for America. Time to judge HIS American Churches who’ve gone apostate, and to judge America as a corrupt nation. YAHUSHUA (JESUS CHRIST) is soon to literally return to Earth to reign 1,000 Years, but, even before that, comes the Anti-Christ for a short while. If the Federal Government will not run the country the way they’re supposed to, then, individual States must defend their rights and Freedom, NOT sit back and cave in to a potential Dictatorship.

    edit this on October 25, 2012 at 4:43 pm | Reply Scarlett

    Hi Gordon, just having my first morning coffee here, and you’ve written a good comment that’s going to require an equally thought out response.

    Well, if you are a Chuck Baldwin follower it’s highly unlikely that you will agree with what I’m going to say, but here’s the deal. I’ve probably been just as much of a patriot and Constitutionalist as anyone around, but I believe the LORD showed me an example a few years ago that I was to emulate and here it is….since we are to follow the example of the LORD JESUS CHRIST, where do we ever seeing him being either patriotic or militant in the gospel accounts as far as politics were concerned?

    Clearly Rome was as corrupt as America is now. But we never see in the gospels where Jesus suggested that his followers be patriotic or take up arms against the government. On the contrary, he told Pilate, “If my kingdom were of this world my servants would fight”. Which brings us to the “taking by force” part. Jesus said, “The kingdom of heaven suffers violence and the violent take it by force”, But this world is not heaven. The only way we can enter in heaven is by spiritual clout, not physical violence.

    I agree with you totally on the current state of the churches, government and candidates running for president. I agree that no doubt it’s time for God to begin judgment.

    Now, take a minute and review what you’ve said…basically that the entire governmental system, including the apostate church has become corrupt, and that you believe God is going to start judging both the church and America because of it’s corruption. You believe also, (as I do), that according to scripture, there will be an antichrist one world government that will bring all countries into submission in a very harsh reign of terror and fear, probably by means of a police state and brutal domination. America is heading in that direction as we speak, and from the looks of things is the principle head of the antichrist system gearing up for full spectrum global dominance.

    That is what the Bible says MUST HAPPEN before Jesus comes back to rule and reign. OK then, all that said, are we supposed to take up arms and fight against what God has already ordained as judgment against a wicked and corrupt nation, Sodom America, as Baldwin seems to propose? Blood will flow in the streets, and judgment will happen anyway. Like you said, it’s already over for America. That’s why we see these candidates becoming more self serving and wicked. They are being controlled and puppetized by the ruling Satanic elite under the auspices of Satan himself and God is allowing it as judgment! So, is Chuck Baldwin going to get in there with guns blazing and try to change with violence what God Himself has ALREADY ORDAINED TO HAPPEN?

    Look Gordon, I don’t like this any better than you do. I have loved my country dearly all these many years, and used to love what it stood for, just like you, but by reason of the wickedness of the people and their rejection of God and rebellion against God, the result will be inevitable, just as it has for every country that rejected the Holy rule of God. Judgment. We are heading into the end time scenario. But see, it’s not the constitution that God is concerned about so much as it is the hearts of the people in any case.

    God had to bring judgment against Israel many times when they got into rebellion and idolatry. Then the people would begin to cry out to God. So, during the coming judgments in America, many will repent and turn back to God. The others who will not turn to God and repent, will be hurt and/or killed.

    Again, about patriotism, it says in the Word, that as followers of Jesus, we are just pilgrims traveling through this world, looking for a city, made without hands, who’s builder and maker is God.

    (I can’t get online right now to pull up chapter and verse, so I’m winging it 😉 .

    I personally believe God showed us a principle back in those days when the people of God lived in tents, and were basically nomads having no certain dwelling place, like Jesus, who showed us that he had no place to lay his head, but we do know that during the time of his own sojourn here that the Father provided for him.

    We’re looking ahead to Zion, for the New Jerusalem. But first we must cross the spiritual Jordan, after we have fought and conquered the spiritual giants in the land, not by the power of the sword or bow.

    The bottom line question here is…are we going to be as in Psalm 91, as God’s spiritual children, in the secret place of the Most High, under the shadow of His wing, totally protected from evil. where as it says, “Only with thine eye, shalt thou behold the reward of the wicked”.

    May grace and mercy be multiplied to you, Gordon.

    Thanks for your comment,


    edit this on October 28, 2012 at 4:54 am | Reply Scarlett

    PS: Gordon, I’ve been going over some of these comments this evening, including yours and I just want to say that I appreciate so much your knowledge of the Word, the wisdom and discernment in your responses, and not only that, but your love and concern for the brethren.

    Grace and peace to you,


    edit this on October 29, 2012 at 4:53 pm | Reply Gordon G.

    Thank you, Scarlett, for those very kind words. Very encouraging, too! Actually, you beat me to the punch, as I was going to get back with you earlier. 🙂 But, anyway, here I am now. Everything you said is spot on. Your maturity, Love and desire for the Truth shines through your comments, as well. I tell you, it’s a breath of fresh air to see others who are “awake” when too many are just comfortably slumbering in the Body of Christ (well, maybe more are awakening, now, from the sound of the Frankenstorm’s Monster that’s landing). I say all this, not with arrogance (as I’ve been sleeping MOST of my past Christian life!), but, with knowing that it all grieves the LORD, and is detrimental to the sleepers. Have you by chance read Charles Baldwin’s latest Article at http://www.newswithviews.com? I think he explains his position better. We are truly, and mainly, Citizens of GOD’s Heavenly Kingdom. But, even Moses and the ex-Hebrew slaves were forced to fight along the way to the land of Milk and Honey. As American citizens, we simply have a duty to stand up for what is right. GOD set up Capital Punishment (for a GOD Who has prepared Hell and the Lake of Fire—Capital Punishment is “child’s play” in comparison); and guns were allowed in the Amendment(s) for the sake of Protection and Freedom, as opposed to arbitrary and gratuitous murdering. We must continue to just stand up for what is right until that Anti-Christ/New World Order kingdom is finally implented and used by GOD as Global Judgment. And, I agree, if we are put up for martyrdom for the sake of our Belief in Christ, we ought not “take up arms” to retaliate in anger and hatred. But, as American citizens, we are responsible to stand up and protect our GOD-given Freedoms until the day America is handed over to the NWO. America has truly been Blessed like no other country (save for Israel?). And, with that great amount of Blessing, come all the more Responsibility. And, that is why America’s fall will be greater, even than Rome’s or Egypt’s. The bigger they are, the harder they fall. GOD’s many Blessings and Joy to you, Sister!

    edit this on October 30, 2012 at 1:48 am | Reply Scarlett

    Hi Gordon, I’ve been gone a good part of the day and hadn’t had time to read Chuck Baldwin’s article until now. http://www.newswithviews.com/baldwin/baldwin724.htm .

    I must admit, I haven’t read all his articles, but as far as this one goes, I have to feel that for the most part I agree with him insofar as the terrible state Christendom, and the leadership of the United States is in.

    I’ve had the same feeling about the apostate church for years, and believe that it has been culpable in bringing America into the morally sorry state it’s presently in, and also for allowing this type of leadership to take root and get a foothold in the government. If America was not rebelling against God, and the church not back-slidden as it is, America wouldn’t be ripe for judgment as it appears to be at this time.

    It seems that Christians will vote for anyone as long as the candidates play the “Conservative” card, when if they had any sense of discernment at all they’d know they were being played for fools. Why is this? I’m pretty sure it’s because the people lack discernment as well as the fact they’ve become spiritually slothful and very much like the Sodom they claim to eschew and condemn. And was that not because the Sodomites were guilty of pride, idleness, fullness of bread, and neglected to take care of the needy? Can “Christian” America and the mainstream organized church honestly say they are much different from that…(the world). Doing the same things the world does, yet still wanting to appear clean on the outside, haven’t they become like Pharisees on the inside? And believe God will excuse this, and perhaps rapture them out of the ugliness they helped to create? I think not!

    As we, along with Chuck Baldwin agree, America is ripe for judgment, and will the back-slidden- Laodician church escape? No, the judgment will indeed fall. In due time, unless America as a whole, including the church, repent, it will fall.

    It amazes me to see that people are failing to realize that leadership in government has slowly for decades been moving downhill in direct proportion to the moral degradation of the culture and society itself. But here we are in 2012, with no real choice in political candidates running for president. It would be a joke, if it weren’t so sad.

    Chuck Baldwin qualifies his article comments by saying, “Unless Christians repent and do what’s right”. Do I personally think Christians OR America at large will repent? No, I don’t. Chuck Baldwin says, ” We have a God given right to fight for what’s right according to the Constitution and the Amendments”. Really? When God is already laying the groundwork for judgment against this country by allowing the NWO and the anti-Christ government to take over? Seriously? What will happen when and if Americans, Christians included, take up arms and resist the tyranny? Blood will flow in the streets. That’s what will happen, like it or not. The police state has already been gearing for that, and as we know, power flows from the end of a gun, and they have bigger and badder guns than the public at large. Not to mention other weapons too numerous and nasty to mention here.

    Frankly, I don’t have the answer to these things. But one thing I do know is that every Christian is going to have to do some serious soul searching about where to draw the line “on what’s right and wrong in God’s eyes”, not just as in the book of Judges, where they did according to what was right in their own eyes”.

    I do believe with all my heart that we are going to be faced with these decisions in the very near future where it is going to come down to more than talk, but in actually putting to practice what we believe Jesus Christ would have us to do, according to the Word of God…and we’re going to need to have that straight in our own spirits!

    Moses and the Hebrew children fought battles in the natural, against physical enemies—– the shadows and types—–, that we, as New Testament Christians are to fight against spiritual enemies. There would be no crossing over Jordon, (a type of death to self), until we have conquered our spiritual enemies.

    Back in that day, early on, the Hebrew children cried out to God and said we can’t do it. “We are as grasshoppers in their eyes and in our own eyes”. Only Caleb and Joshua said, “We be well able to take them”. I have to personally believe God fights all my battles, no matter what the tyrants do or don’t do.” He has my back. According to Psalm 91, If I am dwelling in the secret place of the Almighty, only with my eyes will I see the reward of the wicked. When all hell is breaking loose around me, My God will hide me under the shadow of his wings. Is that cowardly? I don’t think so. I think it takes a lot of trust in the Lord to believe what He said and act accordingly. Let’s remember that Peter was under the threat of death in prison, but until it was His time, no one was able to touch him. My late husband tried to kill me, but couldn’t, and I did nothing whatever to protect myself. In fact, I had no way to protect myself, but miraculously, Jesus did. You never saw a more astonished man in your life than that powerful man who was rendered harmless as a kitten! I marvel when I think about it.

    Gordon, no matter which way this election goes, I am not looking forward to the next 4 years and beyond, because I believe God is sovereign and He is going to put into place the president of His choice, as part of the judgment against America. It’s not going to be a pretty picture. I have been posting some of the articles of Webster Tarpley’s http://tarpley.net/, and I believe he has a good handle on the ideology of both “candidates”, and the way things are shaping up in America. He’s not an end times “prophet”, but I think he knows what he’s talking about.

    I hate to sound negative here, but really. I’m wondering just what well meaning Christians like Chuck Baldwin think they are going to accomplish by leading a hopeless revolt against a much stronger enemy. UNLESS he plays by God’s rules, it’s simply going to be a slaughter.

    Remember, early Christians suffered much persecution, Read Foxes Book of Martyrs, and they didn’t sound anything like what Chuck Baldwin does, as if they had a “right” to anything. I’m not dissing your opinion, in fact, it’s good to have an opportunity to discuss these issues. We are on the same team after all. And I hope all Christians will give heed to these pressing issues, and certainly get their eyes open to the fact that “things are not always as they appear to be” that comes dressed in “Conservative” clothing.

    We’re getting off topic on this thread, so I may end up making a separate post and moving these particular comments over there where the subject will be better served.



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